Log of the High Council Meeting on 8/07/17

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Lord DaKaren
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Log of the High Council Meeting on 8/07/17

Post by Lord DaKaren » Fri Jan 05, 2018 7:01 pm

Log of the 511th Session of the High Council of Britannia.

DaKaren: Welcome to the 511th session of the High Council of Britannia.
John: Librarian before the meeti...
John: * trails off*
DaKaren: I am sad to report that Trinsic is presently suffering from a pox of unknown origin.
DaKaren: The Kinship of the Rose has set up a clinic in the Trinsic Counselor's Guild in the city's southwest district.
DaKaren: Since transmission appears to be direct physical contact with the afflicted, please take appropriate precautions when interacting with anyone who appears ill.
DaKaren: Now, I hope you've all had time to consider both the amendments to the Seventh, i.e. defining person and citizen. As well as Councilor Warner's decree proposal.
DaKaren: Since there has been no discussion on requests for changes to any of these, I can only conclude that their current verbiage is satisfactory. *looks around the dais with narrowed eyes*
Guntur Kivlov: *smiles and nods*
DaKaren: Are there any last-minute questions or comments?
Ariel Thorne: Well now I'm not a lawyer type so I dunno really what all that jargon was about.
Ariel Thorne: But my guess is it's basically about how we aren't to rally against folk just because they are different...
Ariel Thorne: Though I can't say that it makes me well at ease since I still have an issue with those Drow...
Ariel Thorne: No offense to the Lord Marshall...
Malag aste: *nods*
Tanda: *raises hand*
Ariel Thorne: But Drow still scare me.
DaKaren: That is the essential jist of the 539-A decree proposal.
Tanda: So, an Orc living in Cove is a citizen of Britannia?
Ariel Thorne: *glances again at Malag*
Ariel Thorne: Nnn... no offese sir really.
DaKaren: They could petition for citizenship.
DaKaren: Or, at the very least, claim it.
Tanda: As I see it, they meet the definition of a "person"
DaKaren: Though this does open some gray areas.
DaKaren: *nods*
Tanda: but I'm not sure they "legally" reside
DaKaren: Citizens would still be allowed to defend themselves as they need.
Malag aste: This isn't going to be one of those cows are sentient beings discussions again is it?
Tanda: given in general their behavior is not lawful
Malag aste: * rubbing temple*
DaKaren: No, unless a cow can be clearly understood by everyone.
Martyna Z'muir: Mooing is not a language?
Malag aste: *biffs her from behind*
DaKaren: Not in the logical sense, no.
Malag aste: We are NOT going there.
Tanda: Perhaps we need to add a line stating an application for citizenship can be entered...
DaKaren: Were a cow, or other animal, suddenly to start speaking in a recognizable language...that would be a different story.
John: *raises eyebrows at the odd conduct between Martyna and Malag*
Tanda: so as to avoid the assumption that citizenship is automatic
Tanda: unless taken away by declaration of the court
DaKaren: I felt it best to leave the criteria somewhat open, so as to allow for the natural development of various lifeforms.
DaKaren: Hmm.
Tanda: I mean Ordnok... is a citizen
Guntur Kivlov: *frowns*
Tanda: but he's the exception and not the rule
DaKaren: *nods*
Tanda: Don't get me wrong, I'm pretty liberal about
DaKaren: There are other individuals who some consider "a monster" who are citizens.
Tanda: giving folks the benefit of the doubt
DaKaren: Setatabon, for example.
Dot Warner: Mortug...
Tanda: He's not a monster
Malag aste: He's an exception from the norm.
DaKaren: *nods*
Malag aste: So is Anex'deslem...
DaKaren: Were many to see his daemonic form, they might say otherwise.
Malag aste: But then same can be said about several gargoyles
DaKaren: Thus, the openness of the amendment.
DaKaren: Citizenship, on the other hand,... I am torn.
Tanda: I want Minoc to be able to be a haven
Tanda: to any law-abiding being
DaKaren: Were we to require application from "monster" species, that sets a tone of inequality...
Tanda: willing to conform to most of societies "norms"
Tanda: for Britannia
Malag aste: It does and it also again raises questions...
DaKaren: *nods*
Malag aste: Some might consider my own race monsters...
Malag aste: I don't... but some might.
Tanda: was a time they wanted to hang you Malag Aste
Tanda: or worse
Dot Warner: This runs into the decree's territory.
Malag aste: They wanted to do a lot more than hang me...
Malag aste: *grins*
Tanda: I have no problem with the definition
DaKaren: These are good arguments for citizenship being automatic.
Tanda: of personhood
DaKaren: And of the current citizenship language?
Tanda: The citizenship language causes me pause
Tanda: I understand wanting to promote "equal
Tanda: status"
Tanda: with anyone else born in borders of Britannia
DaKaren: *nods*
Tanda: I am not certain though I like an automatic grant
Tanda: with all the rights to vote
Tanda: etc that go along with that
DaKaren: Voting is more an issue for the Crown to legislate.
Tanda: It's so much harder
Tanda: to take something back and reign it back in
Tanda: than to open it back up
Tanda: If we grant this
DaKaren: I just do not want to potently enshrine inequality into the Seventh.
Tanda: *nods*
Tanda: It also makes me question
Tanda: whether I am being
Tanda: biased by species
DaKaren: Oh?
Tanda: rather than looking toward individuals
Tanda: perhaps my reluctance
Tanda: is from the times I've ran for my life
Tanda: because I've wandered to close to an Orc encampment
DaKaren: Ah... *nods*
DaKaren: Their territorial nature can be...difficult... at times.
Tanda: Were they in the wrong for being true to their nature?
Guntur Kivlov: They... clearly, are monsters.
Dot Warner: Cultural differences.
Dot Warner: *arches a brow*
Tanda: We've had several help us
Dot Warner: Humans can act quite monstrous at times.
Guntur Kivlov: *sighs*
Tanda: such a quandary
DaKaren: So, do you think the verbiage needs to be tweaked, Tanda?
Tanda: I'd like to say no, but my instinct says yes
Tanda: We will never change
Tanda: the public opinion
DaKaren: We are always changing.
Tanda: of all the humans
Tanda: right now
DaKaren: Ah, well.. that is quite possibly true. Sad, but true.
Tanda: I'd hate to pass such a broad law
Tanda: or amendment
Tanda: only to set a race or species
DaKaren: We can, at least, try our best.
Tanda: up for more increased
Tanda: targeting
Tanda: as we make them a bigger "threat"
Tanda: to the way of life of the average "joe"
DaKaren: I do not believe the current wording would do that.
Tanda: What about you Guntur.
DaKaren: Some may not like citizenship being offered to other races, but I believe it is the right thing to do.
Guntur Kivlov: *looks to Tanda*
Guntur Kivlov: What about me, Tanda?
Tanda: With no offense intended
Tanda: you seem to view others with
Tanda: a much more shall we say narrow
Dot Warner: Hostility?
Tanda: tolerance
Tanda: than some of the rest of us
Tanda: and we've seen of late that is not at all uncommon in Britannia
Guntur Kivlov: I agree, you are all to tolerant. Forgetful even...
DaKaren: *frowns*
Guntur Kivlov: of the constant threat to Humanity that this world holds
Guntur Kivlov: and that perhaps you are more concerned with your own egos of holding yourselves
Guntur Kivlov: in such high esteem
Guntur Kivlov: than you would allow any creature with half a brain, and the capability of speech to thank you for
Guntur Kivlov: the HONOR..... of the title Citizen, or Person.
Guntur Kivlov: The whole idea of this amendment is ridiculous. I am simply waiting for my moment
Guntur Kivlov: to vote. a very stern NAY.
Dot Warner: The majority of threats we've faced of late have been caused by other humans.
Guntur Kivlov: Ridiculous
Tanda: His viewpoint is no less valid
Dot Warner: Aye, their actions have been quire ridiculous.
Guntur Kivlov: Bandits of course, and they are dealt with. But the threats that beseech us on an existential level
Guntur Kivlov: are not human in their origin.
Tanda: We sit here, most of us human
Dot Warner: The threat of the BPL was quite human.
Guntur Kivlov: As a response to what though?
Dot Warner: Their own fear and ignorance.
Guntur Kivlov: a council even now sitting and deciding with our second motion of the night
Tanda: and debate the well-being and rights of those who are not
Guntur Kivlov: to declare their very thoughts a crime
Guntur Kivlov: The purity league is a response to a lax and uninterested crown.
DaKaren: Actually, to be clear, the decree language says nothing of thoughts, only actions.
John: *raises hand with hesitation*
Guntur Kivlov: our second vote of the night, chancellor.
Dot Warner: That is absurd.
DaKaren: *nods to John*
John: I, of course, stand with my wife and whatever decision she makes, and would not presume
John: to seek to influence any votes...However, the question was raised about human existential threats to the realm.
John: The ones I can think of offhand are as follows…
John: The Purity League, The Brothers of Valor, Mondain himself, Minax herself,
John: To a degree Rodrick,
John: the human witch burners and evil witches they made worse than they were.
Dot Warner: *nods along with John*
John: Minoc faced them as undead, but they began as humans.
John: The Temple of Mondain.
John: Again, human in blood if in nothing else.
Guntur Kivlov: Mondain and Minax are beyond human, inhuman.
John: They have happened and will happen again.
Guntur Kivlov: And your father knows all too well the threat of Exodus.
Dot Warner: A mage is beyond human?
John: *falls silent, having said what he wanted to say*
Guntur Kivlov: a mage of that scale, of course.
Dot Warner: So that makes YOU inhuman then?
Guntur Kivlov: believe me Miss, if I had such powder. This conversation would be moot.
Dot Warner: Ah, a qualification of degrees.
Dot Warner: Then Blackthorn must be inhuman as well.
Guntur Kivlov: I am not interested in a debate of our "King"
Guntur Kivlov: but yes.... it is clear he operates beyond the rules that we do.
Dot Warner: I know, the logic would be too troubling.
Guntur Kivlov: Do not quip at me woman.
Tanda: I didn't intend to stir bad blood
Tanda: but to point out
Tanda: there are many who fear
Martyna Z'muir: *wants popcorn*
Tanda: for human kind
Dot Warner: Please...
DaKaren: Giving in to fear is not a road we should travel down.
Guntur Kivlov: Chancellor, this has gone on long enough. The time to discuss this was the weeks leading to this
Malag aste: Agreed.
Guntur Kivlov: meeting.
Guntur Kivlov: I demand a vote be called for this amendment.
DaKaren: Aye, it was, and no one brought up any issues during that time.
Guntur Kivlov: *pounds his fist on the table, like a boss*
Dot Warner: Such drama.
DaKaren: *sighs*
DaKaren: Very well then...
DaKaren: We shall vote on the amendments to the Seventh, Article I and Article XX as a block first, since they are referential.
DaKaren: To recap, the amendment to Article I defines a citizen of the Kingdom of Britannia, while the amendment to Article XX defines a "person."
DaKaren: Councilor Kivlov, how does Newcastle Township vote on the amendments to Article I and Article XX of the Seventh Royal Constitution of the Kingdom of Britannia?
Guntur Kivlov: Newcastle Votes Nay. *folds his arms, glaring into nothingness*
Dot Warner: *feigns shock*
DaKaren: Councilor Knighthawke, how does the city of Minoc vote on the amendments to Article I and Article XX of the Seventh Royal Constitution of the Kingdom of Britannia?
Tanda: On Article 1 Personhood, Minoc votes Aye
DaKaren: Councilor Warner, how does the city of Britain vote on the amendments to Article I and Article XX of the Seventh Royal Constitution of the Kingdom of Britannia?
Dot Warner: Britain votes aye.
DaKaren: Adjutant Thorne, how does the city of Yew vote on the amendments to Article I and Article XX of the Seventh Royal Constitution of the Kingdom of Britannia?
Ariel Thorne: Yew votes Aye.
DaKaren: Minister Todie, how do you vote on the amendments to Article I and Article XX of the Seventh Royal Constitution of the Kingdom of Britannia?
Earlhad Todie: I vote aye on Article 1
Earlhad Todie: Aye as well on Article XX
DaKaren: *nods*
DaKaren: Thank you all.
DaKaren: The vote is four to one in favor, the amendments to Article I and Article XX of the Seventh Royal Constitution of the Kingdom of Britannia pass.
Guntur Kivlov: Oh good, our first new citizen has shown up?
Guntur Kivlov: Perhaps we should draft a proposal for this new Pox to be a person as well
Dot Warner: *rolls her eyes*
Guntur Kivlov: *scoffs*
DaKaren: The last vote is to decide whether or not to adopt Councilor Warner's 539-A proposal as a Decree of the High Council.
DaKaren: If approved, this decree would both define what a hate group and a hate crime are, and add them to the Codex of Laws.
DaKaren: This would make groups such as the Brothers of Valor and the Britannian Purity League explicitly illegal with the borders of the Kingdom of Britannia.
DaKaren: Any last-minute questions?
DaKaren: Nay? Then we shall vote.
Guntur Kivlov: Let’s get on with it.
DaKaren: Councilor Kivlov, how does Newcastle Township vote on adopting the 539-A proposal as a Decree of the High Council of Britannia?
Dot Warner: What was that about getting on with it?
Guntur Kivlov: Newcastle Votes NAY. and I urge the Council to consider the abuses such a law would bring.
Malag aste: Gunter you and I may need to have words
DaKaren: Councilor Knighthawke, how does the city of Minoc vote on adopting the 539-A proposal as a Decree of the High Council of Britannia?
Tanda: On 539-A Minoc at this time also votes Nay
Guntur Kivlov: *nods knowingly at Malag*
DaKaren: Councilor Warner, how does the city of Britain vote on adopting the 539-A proposal as a Decree of the High Council of Britannia?
Dot Warner: Britain votes aye.
DaKaren: Adjutant Thorne, how does the city of Yew vote on adopting the 539-A proposal as a Decree of the High Council of Britannia?
Ariel Thorne: Aye
DaKaren: Minister Todie, how do you vote on adopting the 539-A proposal as a Decree of the High Council of Britannia?
Tanda: dah dah dah
Tanda: deciding vote
Earlhad Todie: Yes, I vote Aye
DaKaren: The vote is three to two in favor, 539-A shall be adopted as a Decree of the High Council of Britannia.
Guntur Kivlov: *frowns with disgusted acknowledgment*
DaKaren: Now that the votes are done, we can move forward.
DaKaren: Grand Marshal Hla'ate, would you address the Council on military matters in the Kingdom?
Malag aste: With the growing threat of pox on the land I think everyone should be cautious about foods and watchful for causes...
Malag aste: One can't be too careful... and report anything to the authorities if found.
Malag aste: So it can be properly investigated.
Malag aste: We need to get to the bottom of this.
DaKaren: Indeed.
Malag aste: We shall hope for a speedy end to this threat.
DaKaren: I am sure Councilor Jennifer-Marie and the Kinship would appreciate any help you can safely give.
Tanda: If we can contain it in Trinsic it should run it's own course
Malag aste: Those willing be sure to assist the guard tomorrow evening... in regard to this issue.
Malag aste: Other than that, I'll hope to see you all a week from Wed for training...
Malag aste: Unless something comes up where you are called to assist beforehand.
Malag aste: That is all I had
DaKaren: Thank you, Grand Marshal.
DaKaren: Councilor Kivlov, does the Township of Newcastle have anything to bring before the Council this eve?
Guntur Kivlov: *grumpily* The township of Newcastle has nothing of note to bring to the Council.
Guntur Kivlov: Thank. you. Chancellor.
Dot Warner: No more bile to spew?
DaKaren: *sighs*
DaKaren: Decorum.
Guntur Kivlov: I await your next Law against any speech you disagree with Miss Warner.
DaKaren: Thank you, Councilor.
Dot Warner: I'm always going to disagree with hate.
Dot Warner: So should you.
Guntur Kivlov: *shakes head*
Dot Warner: That know "Knight of Virtue" thing and all.
DaKaren: *loudly* Councilor Knighthawke, does the city of Minoc have anything to bring before the Council this eve?
Tanda: Minoc is hosting the charity auction
Tanda: on Aug 17th
Tanda: promoting diversity
Guntur Kivlov: *rubs his temples*
Tanda: and to donating the funds
Tanda: to Cove
Dot Warner: *looks at Kivlov* A worthy cause.
Tanda: Not all of us liberal tree hugger types
DaKaren: I am sure they will be appreciative.
Tanda: Kivlov are blind to the side effects
Tanda: I hope we can work together we're going to need to
Tanda: that is all
DaKaren: *nods*
DaKaren: Thank you, Councilor.
DaKaren: Councilor Warner, does the City of Britain have anything to bring before the Council this eve?
Dot Warner: *nods* Thank you.
Guntur Kivlov: *nods to Tanda, with a respectful smile*
Dot Warner: Mongbat activity remains elevated around the city, despite the ongoing mongbat cull.
Dot Warner: Fortunately, there have been no additional reports of attempted luring of children. Thusly, the curfew for children under the age of fourteen remains in effect.
Dot Warner: Hopefully, this unusual situation will be resolved quickly.
Dot Warner: That is all, thank you.
DaKaren: Thank you, Councilor.
DaKaren: Adjutant Thorne, does the city of Yew have anything to bring before the Council this eve?
Ariel Thorne: Nothing new in Yew to report.
DaKaren: Very well...
DaKaren: Thank you, Councilor.
DaKaren: Minister Todie, do you have anything to bring before the Council this eve?
Earlhad Todie: Nothing this week, but I do look forward the benefit gala next week
DaKaren: Thank you, Minister.
DaKaren: Do any of the citizenry have anything to bring before the High Council this eve?
John: *raises hand*
DaKaren: Lord Knighthawke?
John: I note the sudden appearance of a strange rock formation in the City of Skara Brae.
John: It has broken through the stables there, and stretches from Skara proper through Iver's Rounding.
John: I am sure we all have noticed that it has been awhile since we have faced a true global threat....With this appearance I fear our respite may be nearing its end.
John: Accordingly I urge vigilance...As my father would say keep your swords and spells sharp.
John: Whatever this is...I have the impression it comes from beneath.
Guntur Kivlov: Perhaps it just wants to be a person. We can make it a citizen and charge it for vagrancy.
John: And I have no notion that
John: whatever this is will remain in Skara. What lies beneath never stays below for long.
John: Thank you Chancellor.
DaKaren: Many things hide beneath our feet. Very few of which we would want to meet.
DaKaren: Anyone else?
DaKaren: Nay? Very well then...
DaKaren: I hereby adjourn the 511th session of the High Council of Britannia.
DaKaren: Go with the Virtues.
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